[bzr] Light shines through doors
#41
Quote:Having light on both side of one face just is a problem of the vertex lighting. If there's only a two-dimensional wall it only has four vertecies for each side.

Ah, well. I haven't thought about that.

Of course there are numerous occasions where faces are rendered from both sides. One would think though that faces at least are somehow flagged as both sided or not to speed up rendering. Although, even if they where, that wouldn't help much here I guess, since the secret door would be lit anyway even if the wall faces could be correctly tested. And that would look even stranger. Too bad.


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#42
On a perspecutal side we could solve this by testing on which side the viewer and which side the light source is and light up on that. But that again does not help if you have different viewers (Guidebot, Guided missile). But since most doors are very well lit a simple check on wether the light is visible on the joining vertecies of the door would greatly improve on that.
I'll also check how that works with my newer ideas about this whole topic.
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#43
OK so I have a couple questions...

First I'm confused about what Descenteer said about "original lighting"...does he mean colored vs. non-colored? Or actual a difference in the way light is rendered whether colored or not?

And then also zico...what exactly are the bugs we're trying to fix with the lighting. Is it just that light shines through doors and walls into places that it shouldn't? (Adjacent rooms and stuff like that)? Or is there some other problem as well that I've missed?

Just wondering to make sure I follow this discussion correctly Smile
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#44
Quote:But still this is unrelated to the major issue that light passes even through three-dimensional obstacles as if matter does not influence light at all. If a light source lights up a verttex only the distance to this is checked - not if anything is in it's path.

But that would be shadow casting. Would you want to do this for dynamic lights only or for static lights too?

Due to the - as far as I can remember - pretty high light source count in Descent levels the latter one would more or less directly lead to lightmaps. And additionally would introduce all the aforementioned problems regarding light sources not being placed with that in mind (see d2x-xl).

Or you completely rewrite the renderer, ideally with deferred lighting and GI. Wink

For dynamic lights I wouldn't spend too much time on this, older tecniques like stencil shadows always look awkward and modern, really good looking shadow mapping algorithms, are pretty much bound to newer hardware, I'd guess.

Quote:OK so I have a couple questions...

First I'm confused about what Descenteer said about "original lighting"...does he mean colored vs. non-colored?

What I meant was the lighting as it was coded by Parallax vs. anything done on top of that. Hope that helps.

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#45
Ah ok Smile Cause I know the colored lighting was in the original plastation version of the game...and I'm pretty sure the code was in the PC version...just not used. Smile
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#46
@Descenteer:
No, I am not talking about shadows. If an object casts dynamic light it can light up parts of the level without any visible connection to that - global illumination or not. The vertex just has to be "close enough" to the light source to light up at all - even if there are several walls (three dimensional) in between the vertex and the light source.

@AFP:
Lighting up two sides of a door is something we will prbably live with. What I want to fix is that an object in room A will be unable to light up room B if there is no connection between these rooms that would allow the light to travel there.
If you play D2 level 1 you can put a powerup in the room with the red key and this powerup will light up the room where you start the level sinc eboth locations are close together. THIS I primarily want to fix.
This will not directly fix issues with the doors. A fix for that would be more than it's worth considering there still can be some logic with light going through doors (with a bit suspension of disbelief). A fix for tha tmight be too expensive consider the small gain. But checking for some more realism in light will definately *improve* upon the situation with doors as well.

And this is INDEPENDENT if you enable colored light or not - bot colored and uncolored light work in such an unrealistic fashion.

HOW I am going to do that I still have not decided. As said, this will depend on how much it influences the atmosphere. And all please not again, this only affect DYNAMIC light - not the light built into the level.

The greatest pleasure in life is to do what people say you cannot do.
Uhm... Honey, there's a head in the toilet!
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#47
A Future pilot. The problem is light shining through the mine. A problem that has become more evident with colored dynamic lighting, standing on a white static light background. (that's why it became evident, and that is why light color is involved) But the main issue is a proposition to solve light shining through the mince, although "doors" and "walls" are still prone, as 2D elements with "not enough vertices" as zico said.
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#48
OK, so question...say that the red door in level one was just a wall...would the light still go through it? THAT'S the main problem I've been having. Is when there's just a wall seperating two rooms, one of the rooms will flash with colors if people are shooting in the other Smile
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#49
If it's a 2D wall (i,e, doors, illusions, or any 2D wall, i.e. no 3D space separates one room from another) then I will shine through. The difference in the two methods the original and this one, comes in lighting through empty mine interim space, i.e. your rooms are apart, but close enough to see the light through, with the old code.
Descent Rangers
Captain of Black Lions squadron

The Stalker 21.126
Zica Laser
Guided Micro Bombs
Microcorp HXS Class C
Gravitron PulseWave
Zica SuperCharger
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#50
@AFP:
Even if we incorporate a visibility check the door itself will still light up. Again, this happens in the DOS version as well but we can prevent that the whole joining room will light up.
Of course we can also prevent that both sides of a 2D wall/door will light up, but as said, this is probably not worth what it takes.

But I'll see how I come up with this in 0.58.
The greatest pleasure in life is to do what people say you cannot do.
Uhm... Honey, there's a head in the toilet!
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